tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post2354967665221951703..comments2024-02-26T08:36:18.591-08:00Comments on Ronnie LEBOW: We have become cheap whores.Ronnie LEBOWhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09454861000227182495noreply@blogger.comBlogger85125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-18253591729692157442013-05-24T05:06:35.522-07:002013-05-24T05:06:35.522-07:00I just happened upon this blog and these comments....I just happened upon this blog and these comments. I am not in the design industry but nonetheless I was fascinated and horrified to read what is happening to those within the creative industry. I used to run a business and when I started it, I had high hopes and aspirations. I spent many thousands on graphic and web designers. I thought their work was excellent and was proud of my logos. Then, my business ran into hard times. My profits dwindled to almost nothing and my creative expenditures were cut. Using my computer, stock photos and software, I created my own brochures, advertising and posters. I did what I had to do to get the information out. I am not saying it was great design work...it was not but it was what I could afford. I think that situation is the reality of many small businesses. My business almost crashed a number of times and only survived because I kept focusing on those areas where I made money and stopped doing any work in areas where I did not make money. IMHO, there is no doubt that the situation many of you are facing is terrible, but it seems to be the new reality. As one anonymous poster suggested, apply your creative skills to yourselves, stopping doing something just because you love it, figure out something else you can do to make some money so that you do not need to work at McDonald's. Good luck.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-57552196815988603852013-05-20T05:27:02.989-07:002013-05-20T05:27:02.989-07:00This blog Is very informative, I am really pleased...This blog Is very informative, I am really pleased to post my comment on this blog. It helped me with ocean of knowledge so I really believe you will do much better in the future. Good job web master.<br />Cheap Logo Designshttp://www.brandedlogos.netnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-25663017254349400522013-02-12T22:23:35.447-08:002013-02-12T22:23:35.447-08:00This is a great set of guidelines for proper logo ...This is a great set of guidelines for proper logo design. There are so many traps that people fall into when trying to design a logo. With social <br /><br />media in play, I think variants are a must these days.<br /><strong><a href="http://www.logoego.com%22" rel="nofollow">cheap logo designs</a></strong><br /><strong><a href="http://www.logoego.com%22" rel="nofollow">cheap logos</a></strong>MAry Brownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16771762535763513399noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-21698961675810904652012-04-26T23:16:00.309-07:002012-04-26T23:16:00.309-07:00It's good to see this information in your post...It's good to see this information in your post, I was looking the same but there was not any proper resource, thanks now I have the link which I was looking for my research. <br /><a href="http://www.logoonlinepros.net/" rel="nofollow">Logo Designs</a>Alfred Alberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17923432750011810766noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-58121852413498006232011-03-21T02:31:32.660-07:002011-03-21T02:31:32.660-07:00I am a Graphic Design student at a city college. I...I am a Graphic Design student at a city college. I have a huge passion for print design and identity branding. I've even set up a small screen/intaglio printshop in our garage. My dad was a journeyman printer, making 60k a year two years out of high school. I seem to be following in his footsteps.<br /><br />Except for the 60k.<br /><br />I work my a$$ off every day bettering myself as an artist. I take freelance jobs and kick a$$ at it. EVERY client I've ever worked for has raved about my work.<br /><br />But if I tell a client that their logo is going to take 20 hours at 50 bucks an hour, they'll fkin call security.<br /><br />I hate having to work a three week project for 300 bucks. But I can't help it; I can't land a "real" job, so all I have to rely on is my skill set. So, like a single mother who can't afford to feed her kids, I end up whoring my work out. There's no other way for me to exist.<br /><br />Being an Eagle Scout and active community member, I have a small idea how to organize people. In my opinion, the only way for this industry to be treated with respect is;<br /><br />1) Wait for the economic storm to pass. Once businesses can afford to pay for both overhead and decent branding, we can demand more.<br /><br />2) Then we form a NPO. If we can get a non-profit off the ground, we can educate ALL clients as to the benefits of quality design, and why it isn't cheap.<br /><br />3) Get the word out. Design annuals, community college classrooms, blogs. Let freelancers know they don't have to work for shit.<br /><br />Of course, none of this can come about until the US (and global) economies recuperate.Carlnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-46013888277603018872010-12-16T11:18:21.130-08:002010-12-16T11:18:21.130-08:00You asked if there were other "professions&qu...You asked if there were other "professions" where some slob can simply hang a shingle and call themselves a professional?<br /><br />Web site design and coding. And the music business (especially local bands that play live in venues like bars).<br /><br />it's not the same as being a graphic designer (although some of the skill sets overlap).<br /><br />I got into many of these discussions on the eLance forum a few years ago - and when you are competing for virtual work in a global marketplace you are competing with people in countries where a person can feed a family of 5 on $150/week.<br /><br />There are clients out there that know what good design is worth and are willing to pay for it. It's just harder to find, and it's not on the freelance boards, that's for sure.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-77003808201347624722010-08-07T12:14:46.401-07:002010-08-07T12:14:46.401-07:00I am very impressed with this list! Thank you. It&...I am very impressed with this list! Thank you. It's really going to help me out.Casino boomshttp://www.casinobooms.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-7325830143237532762010-06-25T12:44:15.238-07:002010-06-25T12:44:15.238-07:00This is so true. Well, let's hang in, things a...This is so true. Well, let's hang in, things are much better by now.<br /><br />http://frustrateddesigner.wordpress.com/Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-61700101267479685592010-04-03T16:12:17.955-07:002010-04-03T16:12:17.955-07:00--Part 2--
6. This mentality of society to get so...--Part 2--<br /><br />6. This mentality of society to get something for nothing is going to come back to bite us, it's bad enough that the world seems to have 30 year trend cycles. Watch that number drop until we're all bored out our minds.<br /><br />7. Allot of people in the industry have no real right to be there..they never got a clue to get out or just decided to rape a dead artist from the past and hope nobody would notice and follow a formula in photoshop to get by. Being influenced by another artist is one thing, but you have to also show respect for them...<br /><br />( I hope this is still on track but ill continue all my thoughts )<br /><br />9 Art directors are overworked and stretched, not blaming them but I could see it as tempting for them to reach for lower bids. Sadly allot of responsibility falls on them to keep respectable clients in the loop with professional artists, graphic designers, and photographers alike.<br /><br />Here in lies a huge grey zone... <br />10. I'm surprised nobody has yet mentioned shitty contracts handed out looking for artists to sign away their lives to labour over cheap work. Ad agencies they will try and rape you so be mindful they exist to only pay the artists which look out for their interests properly. IE reads the fine print and actually understands it, and who is willing NOT to just take the lowest bid....which is what they love..<br /><br />11. Know and understand your rights, and only offer short term or fixed terms on how your work will be shown and how you will be compensated. <br /><br />12. Sadly people can or art societies, guilds groups, whatever you would like to call them....will from time to time endorse or even project expected wages for different professions. Often these figures are just pulled out of the air, or published once or twice in a book, and people think that these prices or gospel, or will not change over time or with experience and years spent in the industry. INFLATION its not getting any BETTER, so don't think for a second we need to settle for less.<br /><br />I wish this rant could be summed up with a band-aid and a cold beverage of your choosing, but it won't. Far too long creative talent has been deemed expendable , we have to apply a lifelong commitment to our craft and develop our own armor to defend against exploitations such as this. Every day builds on this principle.<br /><br />Hopefully I can take that journey, and use some of this advice, once i get enough money from my mindless day job... to build the job i really want. I should be almost 40 by then!<br /><br />CheersAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-3975880584916258642010-04-03T16:11:07.255-07:002010-04-03T16:11:07.255-07:00Wow how to tackle this,
Having graduated in the m...Wow how to tackle this,<br /><br />Having graduated in the middle of 2009 in the midst of the world turning upside down. (This is stemming from a BA in illustration)<br /><br />Random Points of Observation:<br /><br />1. Each artist in its respective field can't seem to get along in a group to begin with...<br /><br />2. If by chance some of us form groups they quickly become sing-alongs, and nobody pays attention because they either have no teeth in informing people or applying an actual standard to the public, they are too busy earning money off of membership fees.<br /><br />3. Catering to a business crowd has always been a risk ever since businesses thought it best to turn us into freelancers when they threw us out of their in-house studios, as a cost cutting measure way back. If you think they (being businesses) will somehow find a heart and play ball, when a competitor can find the same level or close to it elsewhere your mistaken.<br /><br />4. Market share has a tendency to rise and fall...for instance photography has taken allot of illustration work away due to the sheer speed at which work can be turned out...sort of what were seeing now with Adobe hacked spin-offs running rampant through graphic design work and illustrations alike. Same concept different form. What Illustration has had to do to combat this is to diversify itself in style and concept to still be a form people are willing to pay money for.<br /><br />5. Art schools ave been turning out art students with the notion they have to make it at any cost, often with no business backgrounds at all. They're in turn told a bleak (ever-changing) scenario, which it's expected to take another 5-7 yrs to get established in your field all the while working a day job to survive.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-6310324543976873322010-03-01T08:18:49.549-08:002010-03-01T08:18:49.549-08:00Thank you! I'm currently working on a websit...Thank you! I'm currently working on a website as a student (close to graduation) for a "friend" who contacted me to basically say that he doesn't trust that I'm keep track of the hours I'm working on his website and that he'd rather pay me a flat fee of $200 for his 9 page website than pay me $15/hour. Now I can get a mediocre site up and running in about 15-20 hours, but since he is an "up and coming musician" and more than likely he's going to have a lot of people see his site it would have taken me (and still will take me) minimum 30 hours to get it working. Let's add in here that I have asked him for his content about four times now and he has yet to give it to me. He also wanted me to teach him how to update it. As payback for way underpaying me for this website (I am selling myself so short on this job) I'm going to make sure that should he give my name to someone looking for a site that it will be his head if he says he got the website for $200 and no way in hell will he ever get the files for his website, if he wants his gigs updated he can email me and I will update it. I am also going to threaten that if he somehow figures out how to get a hold of the files and messes up the html at all, it will be $200 for me to fix it for him. <br /><br />He believed that it would only take 10-15 hours to get the website up and running. I wanted to smack him in the face. People seem to think that because we use programs such as photoshop that all the work is done for us and that it's an easy feat to get things done. They don't realize all the planning and brainstorming done prior to building said website/logo/printwork what have you. <br /><br />It angers me when I see people saying "LOOK WHAT I DESIGNED!" and it's a piece of crap clip art thing they pulled together in microsoft paint.Shaunahttp://www.frenchtoastandmimosas.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-17282798991286264962010-02-21T21:13:11.487-08:002010-02-21T21:13:11.487-08:00Standard base fees? Penalties for those who don&#...Standard base fees? Penalties for those who don't conform? Great. Another labor union. Next we'll see bad attitudes, disdain for the customer, and threatening to break the kneecaps of any scab who dares to compete.<br /><br />Its a simple law of economics: you get paid more for work that other people can not or will not do. Sitting in front of a computer in an air conditioned office must seem better than crawling around in someone's basement replacing the HVAC system. <br /><br />Since none of us wants to repair HVAC, their techs get paid more. <br /><br />Can you show a customer why your work is worth much more than $2 per hour? Well, can you? Then do it. If you can't, I understand HVAC is one of the more popular distance learning programs.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-63598180887378819492010-02-17T06:28:36.639-08:002010-02-17T06:28:36.639-08:00Refreshing indeed!
So, why aren't the Ad organ...Refreshing indeed!<br />So, why aren't the Ad organizations we belong to rallying behind this cause? <br /><br />Beyond motivating our advertisers to roll out their marketing plans and budgets, Why are we not being organized as a unified front to face our clients with the facts and demand what is just plain fair?<br /><br />Can we agree on a standard base for fees and rates?<br />Would we consider penalties on those who infringe these?<br /><br />Beyond integrating the technological and sociological advances that are now reshaping our industry, Are we ready to evolve in the way we develop compensation structures?monvicluchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08794508253199653296noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-67243523863744542752010-02-16T20:25:30.674-08:002010-02-16T20:25:30.674-08:00Just have to stay away from the lowest common deno...Just have to stay away from the lowest common denominator mentality. Why do you think Apple is so successful? People will pay for brilliance. Don't waste your time looking for work from online 'Job' sites. It's a bidding war without the client having ANY idea what they are buying EXCEPT they want to get the lowest price for what they are receiving. They haven't a clue about the value of a strong marketing campaign because YOU are not there to tell them. WHO makes money on this transaction? The ONLINE JOB SITE! It is SET UP AGAINST YOU. STAY AWAY!!!! It is one of the worst ways to look for business if you are interested in actually serving your customer. No one wins with the lowest common denominator.<br /><br />There is more work than you can handle within a square mile of any town. Connect with business people in person. Show them how your service is vital to their business. Keep bringing up Apple. People will listen and people will pay you very well. <br /><br />And Remember to have fun! - RicoUnknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17346914675043776478noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-33714387261436923282010-02-16T14:26:37.720-08:002010-02-16T14:26:37.720-08:00Right on, Ronnie! It's infuriating to see some...Right on, Ronnie! It's infuriating to see some clients don't value education and experience. Moreover, it is truly remarkable that some decision makers in the hiring process lack understanding of the value of brand development and how it impacts the bottom line, especially in hard economic times.<br />however, it is also very important to understand that the same financial hardships that some use as the rationale behind a stupid decision is also put so many great talent on the street. While I agree we must stop being willing to do the work for less than what it's worth, what can we do to help those in need to support their families and are trying to make ends meet?<br />Let's not only stop accepting the work but care for and support each other so as a group we can improve the situation the industry is going through. I am willing to fight for the future of this industry I've loved since the first day at work.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06300056629314159617noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-89495105604066316352010-02-16T13:24:11.353-08:002010-02-16T13:24:11.353-08:00I remember when I first started out in the industr...I remember when I first started out in the industry, the person interviewing me stated, "we are all whores in this industry". That stuck with me for all the years I spent in the industry in various functions. <br /><br />Part of the problem is that the majority of clients have never or no longer see agencies as a real business. As such, the services are being treated as a commodity buy vs. a firm providing professional services. And yes, people who have been laid off, or entry level people to build their experience are falling into the trap of giving it away. <br /><br />We need to keep in mind, no business-minded whore will give away their services.Heidi Grafnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-15826814334663367112010-02-16T12:52:04.274-08:002010-02-16T12:52:04.274-08:00Sad but true.
Since you are only 40 (bless you!) y...Sad but true.<br />Since you are only 40 (bless you!) you have missed some earlier recessions, where the situation was similar. Except for the lack of Mac...<br />I firmly believe that it is time to make our profession a certified occupation. Without qualifying to be an accredited designer, no Mac Monkey should be allowed to work in the business.Who certifies, and who legalizes this procedure, I will leave it to the authorities, but smart business people know that leaving the fate of their brands in the hands of a monkey, is a serious risk.<br />That is one of the reasons why 9 out of 10 new businesses fail.<br />Enjoy your next 40 years, cheers, Ilanilangevahttp://www.ilanandfriends.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-20455614062917084312010-02-16T06:11:36.120-08:002010-02-16T06:11:36.120-08:00YES, dear designer's.. stay AWAY from CROWDSOU...YES, dear designer's.. stay AWAY from CROWDSOURCING sites. Partly it's the designer's fault, many of us are educated in design, but very very few has any business knowledge.<br /><br />I believe one of the solutions is to educate the designer's with proper business practices. Nobody in other industry eg."accounting" will respond to such request, why? <br /><br />Because nobody ever touch on the business practice of design, schools just simply brush them off, pretending it's not necessary. Each of us need to spread the word, to other designers, to every junior designers, promote NOSPEC! articles. If everybody do their part, no matter how long it is, things will turn around.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09876358867054018588noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-89300919775251764852010-02-12T04:48:32.358-08:002010-02-12T04:48:32.358-08:00People get what they pay for. Some people just wan...People get what they pay for. Some people just want any ol' logo or design done. Historically, however, new offerings like the computer and internet (email) have threatened typesetters and post offices respectively, but there have been other opportunities that became apparent afterwards that were hard to predict, much less imagine. For example, though email may have caused a steep drop in physical letters, the internet provided eBay which offered a lot of parcels for the working postman. I don't know what these logo sellers will do, but hey, it's a changing world and there will be positive and negative outcomesMr. Jimmyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04899437111583579028noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-14433338131140060712010-02-04T18:39:41.446-08:002010-02-04T18:39:41.446-08:00I feel your pain, I'm facing the same giant an...I feel your pain, I'm facing the same giant and from time to time I question if I should stay or leave. I'm still here for the love of the trade, in my case photography but I don't like to feel raped either so I just don't get as much work as the other picture takers because they will work for peanuts.Bryan Morrishttp://www.bryanmorrisphotography.com/blognoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-27723624913373406142010-02-03T16:00:41.848-08:002010-02-03T16:00:41.848-08:00Pretty much everyone's a whore for the right a...Pretty much everyone's a whore for the right amount of money; but $2/hour shouldn't be the right amount.Markhttp://www.uniqueimagesphotography.ca/blognoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-55169774302634331382010-01-28T10:30:04.579-08:002010-01-28T10:30:04.579-08:00I have so much to say and so little time. But than...I have so much to say and so little time. But thank you, THANK YOU, for writing this!!<br /><br />-TTanyahttp://www.designbytanya.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-52655622159473846052010-01-09T16:51:58.854-08:002010-01-09T16:51:58.854-08:00Let's consider how and why it got so bad. It i...Let's consider how and why it got so bad. It is a sad situation for sure and I feel we are all to blame. This problem is not exclusive to the design industry. Greed has put the world into the economic state it's in. Perhaps greed has turned us all into snob designers charging exorbitant rates which in turn has brought about $2/hr designers and crowd-sourcing websites.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-46971772298821075582010-01-01T04:29:09.956-08:002010-01-01T04:29:09.956-08:00Bravo, the excellent messageBravo, the excellent messageAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20099402.post-2262603611944065122009-12-17T11:58:13.767-08:002009-12-17T11:58:13.767-08:00We do need to organize. Does anyone know if HOW or...We do need to organize. Does anyone know if HOW or any other publication has written on topic? How about the Graphic Artist Guild? I'm not a member, but it seems like something they should support our efforts in.<br /><br />If you're a freelancer you might have come across <a href="http://www.howdesign.com/article/hourlyrates" rel="nofollow">this article</a> on hourly rates...which shows the national average (U.S.) rate for freelance designers is between $65-74 p/h. I also saw somewhere else that $65 is the national average overall.<br /><br />I don't know if it's by petitioning or writing letters, that we can get something done to protect our industry. (You'd think publications like HOW would be on-board. If their readers can't afford to buy their subscriptions – because they work for $2 p/h – it could be a huge loss for them.)<br /><br />I really don't understand clients who would like to work with someone overseas. Aren't we all fed-up with dealing with any company's tech support that has been farmed out to a foreign land? <br /><br />We need to educate our newbie designers (and ALL DESIGNERS) not to participate in crowd-sourcing, and not to work for anything less than $65 (give or take a slight percentage). This includes those "get-a-freelancer-type-websites." <br /><br />Let's save our jobs. If anyone out there has experience in writing petitions, (I don't even know who to address a petition to for this) I would recommend going on Change.org (or something) and get one going!Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09870503008124164219noreply@blogger.com